Joseph D'Angelo

Joseph D'Angelo: [00:00:00] Think about DORA, right? The Digital Operational Resilience Act , the goal of which is to ensure that you have things covered, like stressed exits and viable recovery testing, all these sorts of things, all of that, it actually plays so well into the technologies that we have especially when we started out testing.

One of the things we really do that's awesome is the ability to actually test a recovery like non-disruptively from your application so that you know that I have this plan, but unless I test it and verify it. Everyone talks about backups, it's the restore that really matters. The backup is I, okay. I copied data from A to B. Does that mean my business can be resumed? How do I know that I can do that? And I'm validated? I have the confidence to do that. And that's the kind of the areas that we operate in. And so many of our biggest customers, the ones that really depend on this, they're heavily regulated environment.

Financial services, healthcare, government, the highest levels of regulation, and they still rely on this technology.

Ashish Rajan: Have you ever been part of ransomware incident? You realize your backups are corrupted. [00:01:00] This is not a situation I would wish on anyone, but this is where data resiliency comes in. I had a conversation with Joseph D'Angelo.

Who is from Arctera and we spoke about why is data residency important, more important than ever today, in this particular day and age, where we are dealing with public cloud, multi-cloud, hybrid cloud, container clouds, there's all kinds of different hybrid compute that we have to look after.

And is data resiliency just as simple as the fact that I can do, press a button and do a data backup. Why not use cloud native? If that's all I wanted to do all that a lot more in this conversation with Joseph. This episode is sponsored by Arctera, so shout out to the team Arctera for sponsoring this episode.

If you find this episode valuable, definitely hit the subscribe button and I will talk to you in the next episode. Enjoy. Peace. Hello, And welcome to another episode of Cloud Security Podcast, I've got Joe with me. Hey Joe. Thank you for coming to the show, man.

Joseph D'Angelo: Oh Ashish. This is great. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.

Ashish Rajan: I would love to for you to start with a bit of intro about yourself so people get to know a bit about yourself and how you got into where you are today, man.[00:02:00]

Joseph D'Angelo: Oh I'd love to. So Joe D'Angelo, I run the product management for InfoScale at Arctera. I hail from the upstate New York. I live in Rochester, New York. And I've been been in the IT industry now for almost 25 years. Started in college, did the goal, computer science moved into a customer role for a few years.

I've been in, I've been working with Partners, Consulting and for the last almost 15 years I've been at Symantec, Veritas, and now Arctera. All the same company just transformed over the years helping customers work through some of their most challenging disaster recovery software, department storage and cyber resiliency challenges.

Ashish Rajan: I think talking about cyber resiliency we were talking about this offline earlier. How do you define data resiliency today and how is it different to backups?

Joseph D'Angelo: That's, that is an absolutely great question, and I think it's important to establish that distinction. For us data resiliency is, what I like to say is a panoramic view of your enterprise.

It's a panoramic view of your data center. It's a way to look at not just the the data that exists in your data center, but the services and applications, which are the [00:03:00] consumers of that data. It's like the two sides of the same coin, right? If you've got data sitting somewhere. It's no good unless you can serve that out to your end users.

And if you've got applications that can't access their data, then it's, again, it's only half of the equation For us, data resilience is being able to provide a means to do both of those at scale in response to some of the biggest challenges. And, darkest threats that happen to to customer

Ashish Rajan: Oh, and this kinda leads me to another question, which you had talking about this earlier. 'cause a lot of people hear the word backup and they almost think come on man. What's the worst thing that can happen? Worst thing. I get a delayed backup. But 'cause I love the example 'cause you guys have been working with people in the regulated space and the public sector where I, I just to paint the picture for a lot of people how different do you, the consequences of data resiliency can be, or the scale of it? How. I guess how important it can be for certain organizations that perhaps are in the government or in the regulated industry, like health?

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah. I like to say that [00:04:00] and I, my, my colleagues join me in this, that when a situation happens with the environments that we operate in, if there's an outage, if there's downtime, unfortunately this people are updating resumes. There are stock prices that go down. There's reputations that are irrevocably damaged.

And CEOs are concerned and they're woken up in the middle of the night. Whereas if a backup infrastructure goes down. Actually nothing outward happens, right? The, your customers aren't gonna know the, at the end of the day, it is definitely a, an issue that needs to be resolved and it will be, but it doesn't fundamentally alter a business.

And it certainly doesn't make any headlines. So if you think about all the cloud outages and everything that's happened over the last few years, it typically isn't, there isn't like an asterisk that, it says, oh, by the way, this was their backup system was offline. No, that's not what caused the out.

Something else triggered that outage. And where we live in the data resiliency space is in response to those types of outages.

Ashish Rajan: What would be an example of a cyber threat from that perspective? Just to paint the picture for I, I guess maybe to your point because a lot of people may confuse the data resiliency part [00:05:00] with I've got backup.

So if something does go down I can just use a backup. What are some of the examples of cyber threats here that you guys find?

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah, I mean, let me think about the, what a cyber criminal or a bad actor would actually target, right? Certainly backup images are something that, they are now looking to pinpoint.

But we are sitting in the primary data path, right? We're operating in a space that is at the forefront of those threats. And for us our goal has been to how do we galvanize a customer's cyber resiliency postures, that they can use that primary data layer as a means to mitigate what those threats might be.

So if someone tried to exfiltrate your data beyond, say your data center that sits inside of a a Ukrainian data center. Where there's potentially a threat for military forces trying to exfiltrate your data. Those are examples where customers have come to us and said that this is the problem we're facing, this is the crisis that we have.

How do I ensure that someone doesn't just come in and then pull those data, pull those drives and walk away with it? So [00:06:00] our technology is designed to help address a, just a vast, number of different threats. Again, whether it be exfiltration, data corruption and then give you a means to restore that rapidly in alignment of it.

Ashish Rajan: I think data corruption is an interesting one because very common one that probably is top of mind for a lot of people is ransomware. And I think I was just, 'cause obviously a lot of people who are watching this interview are in the cloud space, multi-cloud space or the hybrid cloud space, or even Kubernetes space for that matter.

Ransomware in that context looks a bit interesting as well because initially the thinking was that, oh, someone has logged out my workforce from the laptop, and I don't have a way to get the backup, but what people overtime found was that it was just not the laptop or the local servers. They were also corrupting the backups.

So you think you are backing up you're restoring from your backup, where technically restoring a corrupted backup.

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah, the I like to say we remove the problem instead of just move the problem around the port, right? So if you [00:07:00] have a situation where you want to ensure you have a healthy and valid recovery point, it's all well and good to have copies of your data.

But unless that copy itself is also free from any contaminants, then there, there's an opportunity there for you just to perpetuate the problem yourself. So for us, our architecture allows you to not only create those recovery points, which are consistent with the applications that you're running.

Those recovery points can be both immutable and off host, which then can be used in, in for the purposes of scanning and malware detection. So you could actually verify that your recovery point is healthy. But now you can have massively large data sets that can be restored very quickly because of the nature in which our storage resources are consumed and allocated.

So it's taking advantage of some of the, traditional storage technologies. It's applying it to a much more modern use case.

Ashish Rajan: So how is traditionally data resiliency performed? I'm thinking more from a people who are in the cloud space. They are, they're thinking that, Hey, clearly I can just use my cloud native [00:08:00] backup.

Sure. Why do I need a special thing for this resiliency part?

Joseph D'Angelo: I'll say this much, and this is a very commonplace expectation is that when you think about the public cloud, there's this notion of shared responsibility and it's a very important concept to, to recognize, and that is, as a tenant, we're a consumer of cloud resources.

You have a responsibility to certain things, especially the applications that are in the cloud. For the cloud itself, the infrastructure and the network, the cloud provider is responsible for the resiliency of the cloud, but at the end of the day, there is a brick wall at a very opaque layer between that infrastructure and your application.

Meaning there is nothing the cloud provider is gonna do for you if your application falls. There's nothing the cloud provider is going to provide you if you have a failure of your application service, right? It's a blue screen. Anything along those lines are completely abstracted from the cloud provider and the shared responsibility model mandates that you implement solutions to help address that.

Our goal has been [00:09:00] to bridge that gap so that customers can have the levels of availability, the levels of resilience, and the levels of durability in the cloud, regardless of what that threat may be.

Ashish Rajan: Alright. To your point, it's more 'cause I guess I. Because when you said that the first set that came to mind was, oh, maybe.

So is that primarily a concern for a large enterprise regulated boards, or should smaller companies also think about this as well?

Joseph D'Angelo: Honestly, I think everybody should be thinking about this, right? It is the most consequential impact that anyone consuming cloud resources is going to face, right?

If I have an outage, if I have some kind of downtime. What am I going to do to restore this? And many cases, and the cloud providers themselves, they are very upfront about this, right? It doesn't matter if it's AWS or Azure or GCP or OCI, they all have their shared responsibility. And so it doesn't matter if you've got one application or a thousand applications, if that application matters to you, right? It means something to your business. And if it goes offline, we'll have some [00:10:00] sort of negative impact. This is stuff you gotta be thinking about.

Ashish Rajan: And to your point about the concept of how is this done today? I'm curious because it, I would've thought a lot of times people would think about data like, that's a solved problem, right? Why we still talking about 2025? Why is this a problem?

Joseph D'Angelo: There's a thousand different tools out there that could move a bit of data from point A to point B, right?

Replicated it. There's a thousand technologies that do that, but there are not a thousand technologies that will look at that and say how do I take your business or your enterprise and make sure if it was running over here, now it's also running over here. It's not just moving blocks of data for A to B, it's about that, the expectation of what those services are, the applications the tapestry of things that you need to run your business.

Look at your enterprise and say, what is most consequential to you? Is it, are you trying to maintain the cost structure? You're trying to maintain your reputation, you're trying to maintain your customer satisfaction, whatever those outcomes are, we wanna make sure that you can continue those going into whatever your [00:11:00] disaster recovery plan is, or even know local hyper recovery.

Ashish Rajan: Actually how is there a compliance framework that attached to all of this? I imagine a lot of people are also thinking that. Okay. We are primarily talking about public sector or companies who on the regulated space, like health sector is there any compliance requirement that drives data resiliency?

Joseph D'Angelo: Think about what's most recent. Think about DORA, right? The Digital Operational Resilience Act , the goal of which is to ensure that you have things covered, like stressed exits and viable recovery testing, all these sorts of things, all of that, it actually plays so well into the technologies that we have especially when we started out testing.

One of the things we really do that's awesome is the ability to actually test recovery. Non-disruptively from your application so that you know that I have this plan, but unless I test it and verify it. Everyone talks about backups. No, it's the restore that really matters. The backup is I, okay.

I copy data from A to BI. Does that mean my business can be resumed if something goes on there? How do I know that I can do that? And I'm [00:12:00] validated? I have the confidence to do that. And that's the kind of the areas that we operate in. And so many of our biggest customers, the ones that really depend on this, they're heavily regulated environments.

Financial services, healthcare, government, the highest levels of regulation. And they still rely on this technology to achieve those those, resiliency outcomes.

Ashish Rajan: Yeah I love the example you gave about simulation because as a ciso so I think the last company that I've worked for, they either had a SOC 2 Type 2, NIST, or a ISO 27001.

All of them require some kind of resiliency testing or disaster recovery, as we would call it. And the most simplest test used to be that, hey I get a developer or a SRE or someone and basically someone from my team and someone from their team, we just come together once every six months or once every year, and we just do what you said.

We take a week, the backup from one place to the other and could think kumbaya after that.

Joseph D'Angelo: I have, I have a funny story about that testing. When I first started in my career, one of the things that we did for DR Testing is [00:13:00] we all right, we get into the conference room, we sit around our table, there'd be somebody who's the database teams, we network team somebody from the, from leadership, we'd all get there.

And we not literally spin, a golf tee, but figuratively spin the golf tee, point the figure and say, okay, you had the day off. Yeah. What, like that person cannot be part of this recovery plan because they're not available because they suffer from the same fate they were in the data center when the meteor hit it.

Now I know that's a very morbid example, but it's actually fun. Numbers got off and we, but we still had to realize that. We cannot rely on tribal knowledge. We can't rely on somebody knowing that one script, with that one tool and that one process with the commands and everything. No, it's gotta be documented.

It's gotta be tested, it's gotta be verified, and it's gotta be repeatable. And that was drilled into me years and years ago. And our goal has been always to to create solutions that give you that, that luxury of doing that right, automating it, making it repeatable, making it scalable, making it into it.

Ashish Rajan: So how [00:14:00] much has it changed from where it used to be and where is this data resiliency going?

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah that's a great question. I think traditionally data resiliency was focused on the, this notion of protecting from fires, floods. Fault lines and fat fingered commands. It's an alliteration I use all the time.

That's the truth. Everybody was worried about something that was maybe a little bit more tangible. I can put my hand on a server and say, oh, this disc drive failed, or this memory dim went out, or this network out. Something that was, that could manifest in a way that you could visualize.

What we've changed now is the threat. The one that's most consequential is somewhat ambiguous, right? It's this notion of cyber attacks and ransomware attacks, which have, they don't discriminate anywhere. Doesn't, if you don't live in a floodplain, you're probably not gonna, data center's not gonna flood, right?

But a ransomware attack is gonna come for any data anywhere in the world. It doesn't matter. So having to [00:15:00] establish a posture which prevents from a cyber threat or gives you an out or a means to mitigate that's the primary challenge. And then everything else, those are all now implicit, right? So you hit the DR, you get the meteor shower, the flood, the fault line, and all that sort of stuff.

You get that implicitly. Whereas before, people were somewhat challenged in, in, in these types of recoveries.

Ashish Rajan: Every time people talk about having a non-cloud native solution, a lot of times people talk about the operation complexity that comes with it. Yeah. What, how are data resilient softwares, for lack of better word, it's supposed to be part of cloud environments or multi-cloud environments where it's not to what you said. If my job is on the line pretty much every time there is a glitch. Yeah. Even for a second. That sounds pretty intense. I'm just thinking of extreme scenario to just to paint the picture for what I mean, 'cause I, that's an extreme scenario for, you don't want any kind of latency or complexity added to the existing complex.

Joseph D'Angelo: No. [00:16:00] We don't. We don't. We wanna be an agent for progress, not just change. We don't just wanna do something different. We wanna do something that actually helps the environment. What we're finding is that data centers are just increasing in their heterogeneity. The diversity in the data center is only going up. You're not seeing things that are homogenous anymore. And with that though, comes a very important need for automation.

So for us, our goal has been about addressing the scale across the diverse set of ecosystems. Consistency in terms of the capabilities, the functionality. And the outcomes, right? But then we're not disavowing the fact that you're going to do things slightly differently in say, a Kubernetes cloud native container world versus a physical server world.

You might do something slightly different in AWS that you would in Azure. You might do something differently on Linux that you would on windows, but where is the overlap that we can provide those efficiencies? And that's the goal. That's what we've always been championing.

Ashish Rajan: And do you find that the need for being native? 'cause I think there was a [00:17:00] whole conversation about when at least the cloud wave was forming decades ago now. A lot of them was talk, talking about, hey, traditional solutions for backup don't really work in the cloud space.

A better way to approach this. Yeah, I think what's the way these things can be,

Joseph D'Angelo: Evolve or dissolve? Is that, yeah.

Ashish Rajan: I guess how has it evolved for data resistance in the cloud space? 'cause I feel like to your point maybe people like having agents now earlier I remember.

And this is going back way, way back, installing anything on your laptop, which is more on top of what you already had was like a Oh,

Joseph D'Angelo: Layer upon layer I used the roof analogy. How many layers of shingles can you put out of this thing? Literally, yeah. You gotta give in a full roof, roof tear off at some point.

Completely get it. And I like to think that where we live in the operating system space, we own the data path. So we're not necessarily a layer on top of that, but we are more an integrated component that actually optimizes those workloads. And whether it's a containerized [00:18:00] environment where we're actually in the Kubernetes layer itself, right on those worker nodes as a container ourselves or inside of the operating system in a way that is able to be deployed similarly to the rest of the OS using say YAML on Linux or MSIs and unattended installations on windows or the all the native components that exist in some of the, even the traditional Unix architectures.

Ashish Rajan: That complexity makes me also think that, does that mean the need for resiliency is also evolving, like the way data defenses happening need to be more real time, needs more application aware.

Is there the complexity that is there in these days where you mentioned containers, you mentioned, we, a lot of enterprises are already hybrid. They probably have a private cloud, public cloud, multiple clouds and doing data resiliency across the board. Is this evolving there as well in terms of if a container, that's like a workload that may not exist by the time I get to it.

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah. In the situation with containers, and while naturally those began as more an ephemeral type of technology, like any good technology, it gets co-opted [00:19:00] for persistent stateful workloads. Think about virtual machines, right? Everybody's let's play dev test environment. Now virtual machines are all people wanna deploy for their most production, high sensitivity and highly critical workloads.

So same thing is happening with containers from a cloud data perspective. So you need stateful storage resources. You need persistent storage capabilities, but you also need to be able to provide the means for disaster recovery and optimization. But then you have to take it to the next level to make it consistent with the application that's constituent inside of those containers. So for us, it's just been the natural evolution. A new platform new challenge. Yes. But it's the same story, right? I love the I'm a big, Marvel guy. I love those movies. And when they announced that Robert Johnny Jr. Was gonna play Dr. Doom, what did he say? New mask. Same task .Love that line. Love that line. For me, that's, for us, it's the same thing. New platform, same text, right? It's resiliency, optimization, migrations, right? That's another one people will talk a lot about. That's, that could become somewhat of a, a very, challenging conversation, right?

Not only moving to these new environments, or [00:20:00] how do I evacuate myself or extricate myself on these environments too? That's a big part of this as well.

Ashish Rajan: And would you say now we are also working, moving towards this AI world as well. Yeah. Has that changed with the world of AI that you're moving towards?

Joseph D'Angelo: We see AI also as a transformative technology. Two ways, right?

How do we address the growing need for resiliency for AI workloads that customers are using? And then how do we incorporate AI into our technology to make it more optimized for our end users? So right now we're in the throes of doing both of those things. We just announced our latest release 9.0 came out just just a week or so ago.

And with that came us qualifications for some new AI databases that we're providing disaster recovery and resiliency for. We've introduced almost of, new advances that we are working towards in the our product development lifecycle as well as efficiencies and how our customers consume and use all the different elements of InfoScale through through AI chat bots and various anomaly detection and some of the other really [00:21:00] fascinating things that we can do because we are in that primary data path.

And I think that's a unique place for us, we see the data and how it's being consumed and when it's being utilized. And at the same time, we understand in the context of the workload that's using it. So it's a great place and I'm excited about where it's going.

Ashish Rajan: And how is AI impacting the data resiliency space in terms of, to your point different mask, same task in terms of how are you seeing AI kind of change the need for how data residency is done in environments?

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah. What I will say this is that fundamentally it has not necessarily altered the outcome, right? In that you still need to make your business highly available. Your enterprise needs to be resilient. It needs to, address any of the challenges that you may have in terms of resuming your business somewhere else.

Whether it's an AI workload or a, you're a web server. It doesn't, at the end of the day, if it's critical to your business, it needs to be accounted for. I think though, what's happening is that the speed of how everything is coming out is just increasing, [00:22:00] exponentially. So the expectation is that things are supported faster, that they're optimized, that there is little in terms of delay in terms of integration and the expectations are, things happen a lot a lot more expeditiously.

But ultimately though, like I said. Different mask, same task, right? We have to make sure. Yeah.

Ashish Rajan: 'Cause I was gonna say, one of the biggest things that people think about from a data resiliency or data backup perspective is also the trust and recoverability is there are two things that I always think about where I trust that my backup is available.

And recovery is also on the fact that to your point about the the example that we gave for ransomware earlier, we should still be able to recover irrespective of the disaster we face. Yeah. Are there any cultural challenges that come as part of being more data resilient? I'm thinking for the CISOs out there who are building this, either they're making this shift towards what would data resiliency look like in an AI world, or perhaps in [00:23:00] the hybrid cloud world or a container world, they're moving towards. What is some of the challenges, whether it's cultural or technical, that you face it?

Joseph D'Angelo: Honestly, I think there's just less tolerance for not just less tolerance for downtime, but less tolerance for fragmented operations, I think there's less tolerance for bespoke recovery methodologies.

I think at the end of the day, CISOs and CTOs are looking for ways to optimize how IT is now a business function and not just some, cost structure that we have to put out there. So what do we do to make it more efficient? What do we do to make it more reliable? What do we do to make it a driver for growth for us?

So in, in that regard, I think that's changing or the perspective , but then it's just making it that much more critical to your business as opposed to just some supporting function. So that's changed I think a lot over the last few. Certainly it's changed in my career, where, there was, at a time where people are like, okay, we have our, very fixed IT [00:24:00] budget and it's very focused and people didn't even know what was going on in a data center. And it was, now it's like you've, people at home are operating with as much compute capacity and storage as was know, in the early two thousands are, were an entire data center.

So that's changed. But it's at the end of the day, I think that there is a a need for those decisions that get made about the business. You need to be able to not moar yourself or anchor yourself to one decision about a platform, right? There needs to be a reverse gear. Some of us like, call it, or an exit strategy.

Think about the adoption of the cloud, how that's so rapid expansion. What's the biggest topic of the cloud right now? There's a lot of repatriation discussions going, people, I call it the cloud hangover, right? You woke up after the pandemic, you're like, oh my God, I have AWS or I have Azure. I have GCP.

Listen, we, those technologies are remarkable and they have changed the way that we consume compute and storage. But [00:25:00] there's also customers out there going, Hey, I might be able to do this a little bit cheaper on prem and I need tools to help me, bring me back. So those kinds of decisions I think are also factor with.

Ashish Rajan: That's awesome. I, that's most of the, I guess the interview tecnical questions I had I was mentioned you guys are at Red Hat as well this year. You wanna talk about as well?

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah, I'm super excited about that. We're a sponsor at Red Hat. I don't know the booth number. But we we will be there. Our terets our first offense that we've hosted where InfoScale is the primary participants.

This is the first time in my career where I've had that opportunity. And I think that's another example of why, the separation from Veritas but on display will be all these capabilities, especially our recent announcements around our OpenShift virtualization support and customers looking to, ensure that they have an optimized, experience within that decision of, moving from maybe a different hypervisor over to OpenShift VM and making sure that yeah, that it's resilient, it's optimized, it's coverable all those pieces that are necessary against those stateful [00:26:00] persistent examples.

Ashish Rajan: Awesome. I've got three fun questions I've got for you as well. The first wondering, where do you spend most time on when you're not trying to solve data resiliency problems in the world?

Joseph D'Angelo: When I'm what do I spend time on? I mentioned I'm big movie buff, so that is definitely my guilty pleasure.

But honestly it's just being with my family and my, my three kids are super into their activities now. So it's, whether it's caddying for my oldest son, he is playing golf coaching my other son, in basketball or watching my daughter perform in her dance competitions.

Those have really been, big priority for me and it's just awesome.

Ashish Rajan: That's awesome. Second question then. What is something that you're proud of that is not on your social media?

Joseph D'Angelo: Something that I'm proud of with social media. I'm a published poet. Really. I love writing. It's something that I picked up in, in college and it's something I've always enjoyed.

And I've had a few things completely non-technical published, and I I'm proud of that, that, so

Ashish Rajan: you're a published poet?

I

Joseph D'Angelo: don't put any of that stuff on social media.

There's a book of poetry that I've been published in that came out it a number of years ago. But yeah, I always was [00:27:00] quite happy about that. And like I said, worked, started in college. I. And I'm always just maintained it. So

Ashish Rajan: That's great to hear. Final question. What is your favorite cuisine or restaurant that you can share with us?

Joseph D'Angelo: Oh, favorite cuisine or restaurant. Anybody knows me. I have, I'm just a pizza fanatic, right? So I love pizza. And I, long before One Bite, everybody goes to rules. I was going all over the place. Anytime I'd go into New City, I would app to try pizza. My, my wife would just she's so tired of it.

We'd be driving here, be like, I've never had that pizza before. I'd pull over, run in, get a slice. I'm a sucker for a New York style slice. Of course. Honestly, though, the, my favorite pizza in the world is in is L&B Spumoni Gardens in Brooklyn. The Sicilian Pizza there, it's a religious experience. You've never tried it, and you get the chance to.

Ashish Rajan: I will put that in my list for next time in New York as well. But that's all what we had time for. Where can we find the only internet and connect with you to talk more about data resiliency and perhaps what Arctera does as well?

Joseph D'Angelo: Yeah, or I'm on LinkedIn, Arctera's all over LinkedIn. We can I'm sure there'll be something we can [00:28:00] click somewhere somehow. It'll be something for you to click and check out more on the the data resiliency story at Arctera.

Ashish Rajan: I'll put that in the show notes for the YouTube video as well.

But that's what we had time for. Joe, thank you so much for tuning in to do this and sharing all the data resiliency as well.

Joseph D'Angelo: This is great, and again thanks for having me on.

Ashish Rajan: No problem.

All right. Thanks everyone. We'll see you next episode. Thank you so much for listening and watching this episode of Cloud Security Podcast. If you've been enjoying content like this, you can find more episodes like these on www.cloudsecuritypodcast.tv. We are also publishing these episodes on social media as well, so you can definitely find these episodes there.

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